Alternative for Motu 2408 / extra I/O

[AudioWave]

Plus you have 4 assignable sends and returns

Don't you mean 8-mono or 4-Stereo?

 

[cmaffia]

Don't you mean 8-mono or 4-Stereo?

However you want to use them. I see them as inputs and output. Before I got my analog card I briefly used the returns as inputs for my single and dual channel preamps.

 

[cmaffia]

Also the hardware channel inserts are Input/Output, Send/Return if you use the correct cabling. In the early days of experimenting with the board I used channel inserts for my external preamps too being that they bypass the Tascam preamps. I think I also wanted to know if I could send a firwire signal to an external analog mixer using the insert as a send. If I recall correctly, I could.

 

[captdan]

I used channel inserts for my external preamps too being that they bypass the Tascam preamps.

I still do it that way.

Capt Dan

 

[Tuviel]

Good stuff here guys. Never crossed my mind to use the inserts for external preamps. Think I might try that soon. I have several external preamps I like for vocals and guitars especially. Thumbsup!

 

[snafu]

Keep in mind that this will not increase the digital track count: your FW card will still run only 32 channels in and out of your PC. But you will have 8 more analog ins and outs, through the TDIF connection, that you can route in the DM to any of those 32 channels.

Plus you have 4 assignable sends and returns

OK, so let's get quickly into the maths, so we'll see if I got things right:

IF-FW/DMMKII provides 32 channels in total

- 16 x Mic/line which I can route into the PC using the FireWire-connection

leaves me with 16 channels untouched

motu 2408 per TDIF

- I gain 8 analog I/Os at the cost of 8 more channels to be subtracted from the FW count

(16-8=8) leaves me with 8 channels FW untouched

- furthermore 4 inserts, 4 returns (assiganable I/Os)
- plus 8 inputs/outputs (analog) from the IF-AN/DM card

in total 32 analog inputs I could use simultaneously (16 M/L + 8 TDIF +8 IF-AN/DM = 32)
Quiet good for a home/project-studio, in my opinion...

I'd also have a total of 16 outputs I could come up with (8 TDIF + 8 IF-AN/DM= 16) This should do.

@cmaffia: I did not take the assignable I/Os into count - but I got them in mind. So all in all - if I got it now - there's sufficient playground; without PCI card!

So to conclude: the benefit of the PCI-card would be that in effect I had 8 assignable analog I/Os more -but having 8 channels of FW more I can assign otherwise, right? If so, I think I can live without the card...

Thanks to all of you - I'd be lost without your help!

best regards
Thorsten

 

[AudioWave]

Thinking more about this, if your not using your ADAT port you could get an Alesis Ai-3 converter box and have 8-Channel I/O via ADAT. AI-3 units are pretty cheap these days, as little as $100. Some people had high performance mods done to theirs that might be of interest for bit more money.

 

[snafu]

Gotta bump this one more time:

Got my IF-AN/DM these days; now I am looking for the right cables. For D25 cables come in the flavor of XLR male/female and TRS jacks (male).
I'd like to test the card before patching the I/Os to the patchbay (they will have to be soldered - I use a neutrik TTF patchbay).

Both - the TRS and XLR - are symmetric in this case, so the choice between them should not really matter? Only thing that scares me, is that I have to cut the heads with the jacks in order to solder them to the patchbay...
Can someone please advise me?

Thanks again!

 

[jamsire]

I have always said the Planet Waves Modular Snake is the way to go.

 

[AudioWave]

XLR is a better connector than TRS but there should be real audio quality difference worth debating about.

For testing, the kind of end connector would be more about what connectors the gear that want to interface and test with has on it.

One other more simple, less scary but more costly option is to use a DB25 patchbay. DB25 cable between DM mixer and rear of DB25 Patchbay. You can get them in TRS or TT and likely XLR as well.

2-96 point DB25-TT patch bays are what I'm currently using. 4-DM DB25-DB25 to Patch bay, 12-DB25-XLR for racked outboard gear, 6-DB25-TRS for non XLR (4-apollo units) Various patch cable types TT-TT (& TT-TRS, TT-XLR for any un-racked or guest gear)

 

[Arjan P]

Both - the TRS and XLR - are symmetric in this case, so the choice between them should not really matter? Only thing that scares me, is that I have to cut the heads with the jacks in order to solder them to the patchbay...

Personally, I solder most of my cables myself so I have full control over used materials. If that is not an option for you and you have to cut the molded connectors to solder the cables to the patch bay, I'd choose the cheapest of the two DB25 cables. If they don't come with molded but reuseable connectors - choose the type of connector you can use for other purposes.

 

[wm_b]

As a person that has used a 2408 mkIII in exactly the fashion you described above you can do it without a pci-e card in the computer. The Motu will function as an A/D and format converter (but only for 8 channels at 48k and below). You could use TDIF or adat if you like. With the latter I think you can skip the BNC cable.

You will set up the motu by using the buttons on the face telling it where the clock comes from, what sample rate. You'll need to configure it each time you turn it on. It will become muscle memory and you won't have to think about it. I press mine 7 times to get to my workflow.

 

[snafu]

One other more simple, less scary but more costly option is to use a DB25 patchbay. DB25 cable between DM mixer and rear of DB25 Patchbay. You can get them in TRS or TT and likely XLR as well.

OK - but unfortunately I already have a patchbay that's not capable of DB25. As for testing, I thought of putting a mic in front of my amp, and route the signal straight into the IF-AN/DM; guess, this would make up for the XLR connectors.

More important for me is that these connectors (DB25) only transmit audio signals - if I cut them in half to attach the XLR-ends to the patchbay, I don't wanna kill any digital signal. I must once more point out that I never had to go into the technical aspects of this; so these are new shores for me.

 

[snafu]

@Arjan P & wm_b: sorry - you posted when I was still writing. So thanks for your answers

 

[earlink45]

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here but not long ago I had posted a thread that got a lot of feedback on this subject:

http://www.tascamforums.com/threads/connecting-out-board-gear.2721/

I was getting ready to post another question on my old thread but came across this one which has covered a lot and is more on topic.

Is it possible to send audio from DAW/DM 3200 via TDIF to 2408, process it with outboard gear using the 2408's analog I/Os, and send it back to the DAW/DM 3200 via the same TDIF?

If not can someone correct me to achieve the same outcome?

Also can you explain how to route all this? I have been trying for the past two evenings and have been unsuccessful. I just have not been able to figure it out.

 

[earlink45]

Basically what I'm trying to accomplish is process audio from my DAW with out board gear that is connected to the 2408. I know there are other ports that the DM 3200 offers but I have a LOT of rack gear. I am asking on this thread because I believe the OP would gain useful knowledge as he appears to be the same stage that I am in "wiring up".

 

[snafu]

I am asking on this thread because I believe the OP would gain useful knowledge as he appears to be the same stage that I am in "wiring up".

Thanks for joining in - this is also interesting for me, indeed.

 

[AudioWave]

More important for me is that these connectors (DB25) only transmit audio signals - if I cut them in half to attach the XLR-ends to the patchbay, I don't wanna kill any digital signal. I must once more point out that I never had to go into the technical aspects of this; so these are new shores for me.

DB25 analog cable is analog only and is just a specific multi-channel wire format for 8-analog channels on one cable where the DB25 connector takes up less space than separate TRS or XLR connectors. The TDIF DB25 cable is 8-channle digital I/O (& clock) only.

I'm not familiar with MOTU products, but in stand alone mode they may be able to work as A2D and D2A converter using TDIF. You would need to set the MOTU to match the sample rate the DM is set to, clock the MOTU from the DM via whatever the MOTU has for Ext clock options (AES, S/PDIF, ADAT, TDIF, Word Clock) route/assign DM mixer outputs of some kind such as Buss outputs or Aux's to TDIF, then route/assign DM TDIF to input channels on the DM.

 

[snafu]

OK - now I'm even more confused ... thought I DID get it^^

DB265 analog cable is analog only and is just a specific multi-channel wire format for 8-analog channels on one cable where the DB25 connector takes up less space than separate TRS or XLR connectors.

OK, by DB265 you mean DB25 I guess? Put it plain and simple, this is an analog cable (like this).

The TDIF DB25 cable is 8-channle digital I/O (& clock) only.

Ok - now digital? Input of "DB 25 analog cable" and "DB 25 digital cable" into google search bar leads to the same results. So, now analog or digital? Clocking with DM/motu needs a seperate cable, as far as I know.

Or is DB25 something else than TDIF DB 25??

If there is a digital signal or transfer of data or whatever send through the DB25/TDIF DB25 - how am I to solder it to my patchbay? AFAIK you can only send analog signals through a patchbay? Or do I just mix up things now??

 

[earlink45]

TDIF and DB25 are not the same and they are not or exchangeable. You will use DB25 when connecting your DM 3200 analog IO card to your patchbay in which you are taking the route of cutting your cable and soldering connectors to one end. TDIF will be used at the DMV 3200 TDIF ports and connect to the 2408 or whatever unit you buy that is equivalent to serve that purpose for another 8 analog inputs aside from the 8 analog inputs that you will get from the DM 3200 analog i/o card. I will say it again they are two completely different cables.